Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama

First are you all surprised by Gotcha politics or something? the most common example is bittergate and the fact that certain diarists from that shameful period have the audacity to have rec'd diaries telling Obama supporters to give Hillary the benefit of the doubt? this single thing probably pisses me off the most, and I don't have to name names because we all know who they are. Those who GLEEFULLY jumped on his remarks, not to say well this is what he really meant, or when its in context, 3 of the worst offenders have all written give hillary a break diary, she should get the benefit of the doubt, thats nothing short of amazing, but thats another issue.

What Hillary made was a gaffe we all know it, just like we all know every reasonable person will easily know what she meant, but what i have seen yesterday reading through diaries is amazing. NOT only did Hillary make a dumb remark, but in calling for us Obama supporters to give her the benefit of the doubt you ATTACK Obama? I am flabbergasted at this strategy.

Obama made a bland generic comment and hasn't touched it since, Axlerod went on TV and defended her. please go back to the HRC Campaigns handling of Obama's bitter gaffe vs. BHO campaign's handling of this one and you will see the difference HIS CAMPAIGN IS GIVING HER THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT.

and yet dairy after diary HRC supporters are getting upset at Obama?

apparently some of you missed the memo, MyDD posters whether BHO or HRC supporters are NOT campaign surrogates, they in NO way speak for the BHO campaign, they are free to say whatever they want as long as it meets posting rules, but if you don't like what they say fine tell them, but to use it to attack Obama? say he doesn't represent a change in politics, because of what posters on the internet say? you've got to be kidding.

once again, internet posters are NOT campaign surrogates, you really want this to go away alot faster then the bitter gate comment? stop using her gaffe to attack Obama.

This is politics, Hillary is a politician she will take a few licks and finish the race. but using this to attack Obama does nothing to get her the benefit of the doubt. the MSM is NOT media, his campaign is ignoring basically defending her, the MSM gave us weeks of bittergate, a month of Wright, everything passes with time, so stop attacking Obama and his campaign because you are worried about what this gaffe might mean to her campaign.  



Display:


Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 21)

attacking Obama and his campaign at the same time asking that she gets the benefit of the doubt is amazing to me.

random crazy internet posters are NOT campaign surrogates, he can't control them, stop using them to attack him or stop asking for her to get the benefit of the doubt.

because doing BOTH at the same time, in my opinion its hypocritical.


Congratulations to Barack Obama, the presumptive Presumptive Democratic Nominee
by TruthMatters on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:10:43 AM EST

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (none / 0)

You won't find me attacking Obama over this.

But I did read yesterday in a news source (not a blog) that his campaign started this whole thing over the assassination remark.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:42:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 13)

Considering that it went from the video feed straight to Drudge, I have a hard time believing that.


by rfahey22 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:45:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 7)

No it was live blogged by the NY post, and then straight to Drudge.  There is no evidence whatsoever that the Obama campaign pushed it.


by interestedbystander on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:39:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Not quite (none / 0)

http://www.nypost.com/seven/05232008/new s/nationalnews/why_hill_wont_drop_out__b obby_kennedy_wa_112232.htm

See paragraph 3.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:00:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (none / 0)

Sad that anyone even reads The Post. It is not, and has never been a reliable source on anything. They are a tabloid with extensive sports coverage. I tried to make that point before this blew up into (nevermind).

But someone in the Obama camp did respond to it, in a purely perfunctory manner as any campaign should (I have no qualms with that) and then got word from those higher up and Obama himself that this was not to be made an issue, because it isn't an issue. I don't doubt that Obama's reason for speaking well of Clinton or saying what he has said is anything but good will, intelligence and a solid take on what actually does take place in America when people get whipped up into a frenzy and start acting like a mob. It's why Drudge traffics in the sewer he does.

I 'm still not seeing where anyone is implicating Obama, but maybe showing a willingness to listen to why some think so will help heal some shell shocked Obama supporters.

Except for a few people looking for vengeance, pay back,or a therapeutic release, everyone else really has appeared to have moved on. Thanks for helping that to happen.

And if anyone is interested Obama made two significant foreign policy speeches yesterday that are at his website. He gets my vote for calling Chavez the "demagogue" and tyrant that he is. He also reminds us that Iran is not a benign country whose actions can just be ignored (especially since the people of Iran are not running their own country) And he stomps on the current not speaking with Cuba policy that has hurt the Cuban people for so long.


by Jeter on Sat May 24, 2008 at 07:32:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Get your facts straight (1.93 / 15)

The Obama campaign did not get this out there. Unlike the Clinton campaign they are not trolling right wing smear sites looking for garbage to push to the mainstream press.

From the NY Times:

Mrs. Clinton's remarks were initially reported online by The New York Post, whose reporters were not traveling with the Clinton campaign but were instead watching a live video feed of the meeting with newspaper editors. Its report quickly jumped to the Drudge Report, then whipped around the Internet and on television, with outraged comments piling up on Web sites.


by hankg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:15:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (1.33 / 3)

No, I meant something that said that the Obama campaign sent messages around to the news, pointing to her comment and saying it was a Bad Thing (TM) for her to say.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:32:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (2.00 / 12)

Unsubstantiated smears like this belong in the gutter. Post your sources. Either put up. Or shut up.

Supporters like you have done Hillary no end of harm. Do you think you persuade one Obama supporter to turn to Hillary with these baseless rumours? No. As time has shown, bloggers like you have actually turned Hillary supporters towards Obama. I've heard this said time and time again...

So well done for what you've achieved for your candidate. You deserve to slap yourself on the back. Or perhaps somewhere else.


Pointing to the inadequacies of John McCain
by duende on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:37:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (1.00 / 2)

seeing that "Unsubstantiated smears" are your specialty this post of yours is hilarious


by zerosumgame on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:37:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

LIke Honey to bees... (1.80 / 5)

You can't help falling into the hypocrisy trap. You must have heard my previous post calling, because you're exactly fitting the description: another Hillary supporter who has damaged her candidacy. For references on this, other readers should just check zerosumgame's unpleasant comment and trolling history.

To add irony to self revelation you have, just like the above poster, added your own unsubstantiated smear without sources (this time against me).

You're not hilarious. The joke is on you.


Pointing to the inadequacies of John McCain
by duende on Sat May 24, 2008 at 12:46:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

Calm down.  Jeez. Is EVERYTHING a damn emergency in your world?

I'm not trying to persuade you of anything.  I am not a blogger.  I am a mere commenter here and there upon these threads.  The Dem party is going to cave to Obamamania and lose the general election, so why would I waste my time on convincing the likes of you?

You are truly expending your venom in a baseless, useless way.  Not surprising, coming from you.  I don't hold supporters like you against Obama, because I'm fair-minded - I don't like him for his own policies.  But for others, you are helping to destroy his chances in the GE by your trollish behavior.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:39:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

I read in a news source (not a blog) that Hillary eats puppies. May not be true; I don't know--but I thought it was interesting. Don't overreact--I won't hold it against your candidate but others might.


by Brannon on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:51:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

Link, please.

Here's mine:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/05232008/new s/nationalnews/why_hill_wont_drop_out__b obby_kennedy_wa_112232.htm

After you look at it, particularly paragraph 3, go back up to my original comment and see if I exaggerated in any way.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:59:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

So this: "But I did read yesterday in a news source (not a blog) that his campaign started this whole thing over the assassination remark."

was based on this?:

'"Sen. Clinton's statement before the Argus Leader editorial board was unfortunate and has no place in this campaign," Obama campaign spokesman said in a statement.'

I'm curious, what response could Obama have made that would have resulted in you saying that this situation was not in any way his doing?


by Brannon on Sun May 25, 2008 at 12:38:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (2.00 / 3)

That was an official response once it blew up. You expect them to say nothing when asked a question about it?


by nwodtuhs on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:46:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

Actually the article claims that after Clinton said the comment, the Obama campaign "immediately" responded.  I gathered that happened before it blew up.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:11:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Without a link (2.00 / 2)

this is trollable.

I am more than tired with claims based on no evidence.


by fladem on Sat May 24, 2008 at 12:18:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

Their response was actually pretty calm and even for something as outrageous as this... They just said something like "It doesn't belong in our political debate."  Hardly adding fuel to the fire.


by leshrac55 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 01:47:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (1.00 / 2)

Even making the statement that what Hillary said "has no place in our political debate" is to suggest that Hillary was implying anything other than that Democratic primaries in the past commonly went on until June -- for people who are old enough to remember RFK's assassination, the memory of a June primary calendar, because of the tragedy, is loud and clear. The Obama campaign statement suggests that Hillary was saying something far worse, that she was deliberately trying to invoke the specter of a possible assassination in this primary -- and of course, the OFB both here and in the MSM had a field day pushing this completely outlandish interpretation.

The entire tenor of this primary season has left the Democratic party fractured beyond repair. Once again, the former party of FDR appears to be on the verge of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. I hope you enjoy the bitter fruits that Obama's hardcore supporters (as well as Obama's own campaign staff) have sown.


Fortune strums a mournful tune for those whose campaigns peak too soon. --Bored of the Rings
by Inky on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:42:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Get your facts straight (none / 0)

If you wanted, by the way, to tell me that the Obama campaign wasn't involved in getting it out there, fine.  But to follow that up with a smear on the Clinton campaign... well, you continue to do harm to your own candidate's side.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:41:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (1.33 / 9)

"Started the whole thing" -- what are you talking about?

Clinton said that Obama could be shot and killed.  Sounds to be like she's the one who started that line of conversation.


We care about politics because we know politics matters for people's lives and opportunities.
by politicsmatters on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:19:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 3)

She never said that. She stated a historical fact. What you are saying is pure Obama trash.


No longer a Democrat, now proudly an independent voter!
by Ga6thDem on Sat May 24, 2008 at 12:42:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 3)

It's a historical fact.  Since Bobby Kennedy's campaign began only one month prior to his assassination it's also, what, should I say "pure Clinton trash"?  You would.

It's misleading.


We should be able to deliver bottled hot water to dehydrated babies.
by Jess81 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 12:49:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (none / 0)

What does the starting date of the primary matter? The question is whether the party needs to consolidate behind a candidate before June, as Obama supporters constantly argue. Clinton also referenced her husband's 1992 campaign for the same reason -- there's no reason to believe that it's detrimental to not have a confirmed candidate at this time -- in fact, it's probably better for the nominee to be confimed later rather than earlier. The GOP can't really start attacking the nominee in a big way until after the nominee is chosen. I don't understand why we want to give them a chance to start attacking Obama sooner rather than later.


Fortune strums a mournful tune for those whose campaigns peak too soon. --Bored of the Rings
by Inky on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:53:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 1)

HR'd because this is absolutely not what she said.  You have to twist it to make that claim, and that's the typical abuse that I've grown weary of seeing this entire primary season from Obama supporters.  It's the key reason I am not a supporter of his.


by slynch on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:20:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'd like the link for that (2.00 / 10)

as I've read the exact opposite.  Here's the New York Times:

Mr. Obama learned about Mrs. Clinton's remarks as he rode in his motorcade from Miami to Sunrise, Fla., on Friday. He and his aides discussed the matter, but decided he would not address the comment when he arrived at an afternoon rally.

Instead, to an audience of 16,000 people who filled the Bank Atlantic Center arena, Mr. Obama praised the candidacy of Mrs. Clinton and assured Democrats that their party would be united after the long primary campaign ended.


Obama leads the popular vote too
by kellogg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:42:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (none / 0)

just out of curiosity?  why do you think that was reported?


"Me Fail English? That's Unpossible." Ralph Wiggum
by canadian gal on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:28:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (2.00 / 10)

Obviously it was reported because Obama secretly controls the media, including the New York Times, which had earlier cleverly endorsed Clinton as part of a stealth campaign controlled by David Axelrod and Michelle Obama.  In the words of Mr. Burns, "My plan is working perfectly!" [rubbing hands together maniacally]

/snark


Obama leads the popular vote too
by kellogg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:33:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (2.00 / 1)

is this what i suggested?  i was wondering why a BO supporter thought they were reporting it... sheesh.


"Me Fail English? That's Unpossible." Ralph Wiggum
by canadian gal on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:44:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

oh come on, that previous (none / 0)

post of yoru was imply galore.


-- be excellent to each other
by kindthoughts on Sat May 24, 2008 at 02:12:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You forgot the "excellent." n/t (none / 0)


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:09:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (2.00 / 4)

Perhaps because it is news?  What point are you making?


by interestedbystander on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:41:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (none / 0)

That's easy: sexism and Hillary hate!


by yankeeinmemphis on Sat May 24, 2008 at 03:17:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (none / 0)

the missing word in that quote you posted was 'publicly'


by zerosumgame on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:38:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like the link for that (none / 0)

You know what?  I might have gone looking around for the link, but some of your fellow Obama folks TR'd me and told me to shut up and told me I was passing around gutter smears.

So no dice.  If someone had asked nicely, I would have looked around, and if I didn't find it, would have admitted that.  My memory's not perfect or I may have misread while scanning news sites in a hurry.

This place is turning into the Big Orange Satan. Thankfully the moderators are better than Markos, but the comments lately are just fucking over the top and massively offensive and totally divisive (ironic as that may be), which is how it got at DKos because I left for good months ago.  I am more convinced than ever that, with supporters like these, Obama's chances of winning a GE, already very low, have dropped to abysmal.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:46:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Here, take a long look into this abyss... (none / 0)

LA Times/KTLA Poll (5/24):

Obama 47%, McCain 40% (California)

Rasmussen (5/21):

Obama 48%, McCain 43% (New Hampshire)

Survey USA (5/16-18):

Obama 48%, MCCain 39% (Ohio)

SUSA (5/19):

Obama 48%, McCain 42% (Colorado)

SUSA (5/16-18):

Obama 40%, McCain 48% (Pennsylvania)


by CanuckinMA on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:27:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Polls... so useless... so contradictory... (none / 0)


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:20:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

"turning into the Big Orange Satan" (none / 0)

I'm pretty sure Satan isn't a Democrat.


Obama leads the popular vote too
by kellogg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 07:44:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: "turning into the Big Orange Satan" (none / 0)

I'm not at all sure that the majority of the people at DKos are Democrats any longer.

I'm also quite sure that many, many conservative Rethugs would entirely disagree with your statement.  They do indeed believe Satan is a Democrat.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:21:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I bet the vast majority of Dkos folks (none / 0)

will vote for the Democratic nominee.  And I would like to think the same of MyDD folks.  

As for conservative Republicans, what can you expect?  They're possessed. Possessed, I say!  


Obama leads the popular vote too
by kellogg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:25:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I bet the vast majority of Dkos folks (none / 0)

Have you checked that place out lately?  My gawd, they think Clinton is the anti-Christ, almost literally.  How could one vote for someone one thinks is 100% vile?  


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:49:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This was not her first time (2.00 / 5)

A "gaffe" is a mistake said once. A strategy is something said multiple times. Hillary first invoked RFK's assassination in March, and we left it alone as a gaffe, even though she was soon chomping away at "bittergate."

She has mentioned RFK's CA win many times since, and now again has raised the spectre of assassination. This is not a gaffe, she has not apologized to Obama, his supporters or his family, and it's not okay.


by rhetoricus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:08:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

It is a gaffe, as far as I know (2.00 / 6)


by french imp on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:19:10 AM EST

Re: It is a gaffe, as far as I know (2.00 / 4)

I'll take her word for it.


by parahammer on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:21:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It is a gaffe, as far as I know (2.00 / 2)

Take her word for it, if you want. But do you think for one second that the African American community, with it's long history of having it's leaders assassinated, MLK, Malcolm, et. al. will take her word for it? No, they won't. She as much as said she is staying in the race because Obama might get assassinated. Either she meant what she said,  or she is so incompetent in public that she is not qualified for the job she is applying for.


Bush murders soldiers for profit. McCain wants to wet his beak.
by awobbly on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:51:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It is a gaffe, as far as I know (1.50 / 2)

You didn't get the reference... it was a reference back to when Hillary was asked if Obama was a Muslim, and she answered, "As far as I know.  We'll have to take him at his word on that."

She's gone to prayer breakfasts with him, so she knows better, but it helped her campaign in Ohio, so she equivocated.


by LordMike on Sat May 24, 2008 at 01:39:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It is a gaffe, as far as I know (none / 0)

Troll rating for lying about what Clinton said.


by therealdeal on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:12:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It is a gaffe, as far as I know (none / 0)

"doctrine" of assassination?


McCainuire, The Wrath Of Not Enough Naps.
by catilinus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:21:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

It's not her first time. (2.00 / 3)

She raised the specter of RFK's assassination first in March. This is not a gaffe, it is a strategy. And until she apologizes for the insult to Obama (not just to the Kennedys), it's not forgiven.


by rhetoricus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:09:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 8)

Clinton and her supporters could have ignored the bitter remark as a mispoken gaffe.  Bit no, they jumped all over it.
At least Obama has the decency to this one.
by parahammer on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:23:34 AM EST

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 2)

to ignore this one.


by parahammer on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:26:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

I didn't jump on Obama about the bitter thing.

Nonetheless, calling a bunch of Americans bitter and saying they cling to religion and guns is actually stupider in a political sense and more offensive than anything Clinton said about RFK.  Obama literally described some Americans that way, while Clinton was NOT in any way, shape or form hinting at political violence.

I would certainly rather we all stop focusing on things like this, including Obama's gaffe where he thinks the U.S. has 57 states.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:41:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (1.50 / 4)

The RFK comment is a true gaffe by a tired person making a totally different point, while the "bitter" remark is a complex thought that ostensibly came out after some reflection and mental deliberation.

These two statements, in my opinion, are apples and oranges.  Even Samantha Power "monster" remark is more vile than Hillary's RFK comment, because it's meant directly and unambiguously towards Hillary.  

For the RFK comment to be conceived as an attack or a threat to Obama, one has to jump through imagined hoops in logic for it to make sense.  Instead of giving Hillary the benefit of the doubt, Obama's campaign quickly jumped on it, declaring that such statements have no place in this campaign, etc. etc..  Who cares about party unity?  Sounds like Obama isn't ready to drop his fight against the Clintons just yet.


by Sieglinde on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:27:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 6)

Raising the spector of assassintation does not require hoop-jumping.  I never thought she was threatening Obama or anything.  But at the beginning of this primary season there were people in the AA community and elsewhere specifically not voting for Obama because they thought he could get assassinated.  To raise that fear again, and to say that you are still in because it could happen is baffling.

I'll give her that it was a gaffe.  What concerns me is that these gaffes always have consequences for Obama.  Obama's "bitter" statement just affected him.  When Clinton talks about "hardworking whites" or raises the possibility of assassination it effects Obama.  It effects people's perceptions and can effect their voting decision.  SO then she gets to say "Oops, didn't mean it." but the damage is already done.


John McCain isn't evil. He's just wrong about a lot of things. Vote Obama!
by proseandpromise on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:05:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 3)

1. The assassination remark re: RFK was not the first time. She said it in March as well.

2. The person who said "monster" was fired.


by rhetoricus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:10:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

apparently you can read minds (none / 0)


-- be excellent to each other
by kindthoughts on Sat May 24, 2008 at 02:14:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Imagine if a Republican (2.00 / 5)

had made a similar reference.

I could win the race if something happened like happened to the Kennedy's.

If it wasn't a gaffe then Hilllary would never have apologized, er I mean regretted her statement.


overthrow the government~participate
by missliberties on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:54:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Imagine if a Republican (1.00 / 0)

perhaps because there is a real suspicion that the assassination was done at the behest of a republican cabal, might that be why it would not be appropriate for any of them to talk about it? Oh, wait, you probably still think she killed Vince Foster and pimps out their daughter...


by zerosumgame on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:40:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Imagine if a Republican (none / 0)

oops, I mis-used the word think when I should have said knee-jerk


by zerosumgame on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:41:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Imagine if a Republican (2.00 / 2)

Still think?  can you point to any Obama supporters here who have ever made such claims?


by interestedbystander on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:46:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 2)

You have no sense of humor it seems.  The 57 state remark was a joke riffing on the length of the campaign.
And guess what, many Americans are bitter.  Just look around here for example.  
by haystax calhoun on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:16:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

I agree, this site is full of bitter Obama supporters.

Prove to me that he was joking about 57 states.  I don't get that at all from the video.


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:02:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

And the correct number should be 45-1/2, right?


by haystax calhoun on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:27:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

Did you and Obama attend the same school in first grade?


by Montague on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:18:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

This is a joke, right? Get some perspective, people!


by bethmydd on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:23:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

so you are calling RFK Jr what now?


by zerosumgame on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:32:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

Did you read my comment?  


by parahammer on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:33:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (1.14 / 7)

do you read? do you pay attention when the news comes on? did you bother to see when RFK Jr. (obviously an HRC agent of something or other in you tiny mind) said there was nothing to be offended about in that statement?


by zerosumgame on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:39:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 3)

He, like Clinton, acted as though it was just offensive to the Kennedy family.  That doesn't change that this raises fears once again in the AA community and elsewhere that a black candidate is at a higher risk of getting assassinated.  She did damage to Obama with her "gaffe."  That is something we can't lose in this.  I'll give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she meant no harm, but let's not pretend that no harm was done.


John McCain isn't evil. He's just wrong about a lot of things. Vote Obama!
by proseandpromise on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:07:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 1)

maybe RFK jr was not offended but many other people were.  You should lay off the personal attacks typical Clinton supporter.


by parahammer on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:23:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (2.00 / 6)

Um. It might be offensive to the Obama family who are under death threats from white supremacists. But who cares about them right?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:40:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

Well, she apologized to the wrong party.  I have no idea why Bobby Kennedy Jr. would be offended by referring to it as "a tragic day".

Which is probably why she apologized to them, and not to the actual aggreived party here.


We should be able to deliver bottled hot water to dehydrated babies.
by Jess81 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 01:08:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

RFK Jr. can be wrong (2.00 / 4)

As he's also wrong that the 1992 race was "hard fought until June."  The race was effectively over when Paul Tsongas, not wanting to be a spoiler, dropped out in March.


Obama leads the popular vote too
by kellogg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:43:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Another point (2.00 / 3)

If she was using the '68 campaign (and I would say "if") as an example of how long the process can take, then it was a weak argument since the first primary in '68 took place in May.

I will give her the benefit of the doubt on her motivation, but she deserves no small amount of disdain for making a terrible analogy. We don't need any more leaders making stupid remarks on a regular basis.


by bookish on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:57:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: RFK Jr. can be wrong (2.00 / 1)

I believe the calendar started later, too.


by mikeinsf on Sat May 24, 2008 at 03:11:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obvious Double Standard (none / 0)

"He issued a statement denouncing it"

Were it better if he issued a statement in support of mentioning assassinations?"


McCainuire, The Wrath Of Not Enough Naps.
by catilinus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:26:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (none / 0)

Neither campaign, or group of supporters, should use this incident to attack or further any agenda. It was a stupid thing to say by somebody who was exhausted. It should now go away thinks I.


by wasder on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:26:19 AM EST

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 5)

Exhausted???????
She is supposed to be ready on day 1 for the 3AM phonecall.
by parahammer on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:27:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 1)

hah.  I love that.  There needs to be a mashup of the commercial and then all the gaffes she has made that have been due to sleepiness.


John McCain isn't evil. He's just wrong about a lot of things. Vote Obama!
by proseandpromise on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:08:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 2)

Yeah, ending with her fumbling for the phone before screaming into it "I'm trying to fucking sleep here!!"


Bush murders soldiers for profit. McCain wants to wet his beak.
by awobbly on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:57:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 3)

..which would be totally understandable if it was the first time she'd said it, and if she apologized toward Obama, not just the Kennedys. It was not the first time. Reference Olbermann's rant (which was too unkind by far), he gives the history of her "assassination" remarks.


by rhetoricus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:13:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 9)

No one outside of MyDD or Hillarywas44.org is using this to attack Obama.  In fact, most of the press and public seem to be impressed with how gracious the Obama campaign has been (graces not afforded Obama by the Hillary campaign following lesser gaffes.)

There are Obama supporters on the blogs having some fun with this. : )  I beleive the word is "schadenfreude".  The blogs are not the real world and poorly represent the voting public.


by rf7777 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:40:07 AM EST

Re: Hillary Gaffe, Stop using it to attack Obama (2.00 / 3)

well as I posted this on MyDD, then I am obviously only talking to MyDD posters :-p


Congratulations to Barack Obama, the presumptive Presumptive Democratic Nominee
by TruthMatters on Sat May 24, 2008 at 08:46:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

or Talk Left or Taylor Marsh (2.00 / 3)

Hillary makes questionable statement.

Blames Obama supporters.

I would presume to suggest that supporters of the women's movement should not blame others for if their candidate makes a mistake.


overthrow the government~participate
by missliberties on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:57:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 2)

allowed here?

Look, here's what is reported to have been said by the Obama campaign:

Senator Clinton's statement before the Argus Leader editorial board was unfortunate and has no place in this campaign

So can we please stop the claim that the Obama campaign did not choose to jump on top of this? Maybe later they backed down, but their first instinct was obviously to gin up all the outrage they could about it. And, once that dog was let loose, it was easy for them to back away from the claim and let their vicious supporters do the dirty work while the campaign and Obama pretended to be above it all.

Sometimes the pure dishonesty of the claims being made on behalf of Obama supporters for their man is just breathtaking.


by frankly0 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:53:18 AM EST

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 10)

Gin up all the outrage they could?  That comment really seems outraged to you?  Would you say that the comment was not unfortunate?  Would you say that it has a place in the campaign?  

There is a big difference between forgiving Clinton by agreeing that this was a mistake and saying that this comment was harmless. It was not.  Unintentional as it may have been, it was most certainly unfortunate and it does have no place in the campaign.


John McCain isn't evil. He's just wrong about a lot of things. Vote Obama!
by proseandpromise on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:11:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

There's a relatively small number (2.00 / 3)

of Clinton supporters whose identity is tied so closely to their candidate's that they would defend her if she shot Obama herself. You're not going to be able to reason with them because they've lost the last vestige of reasonability already.


by bookish on Sat May 24, 2008 at 11:05:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

Please, don't act as if you just fell off the turnip truck, OK?

Look, the comment from the Obama campaign I quoted is exactly the sort of comment that campaigns issue when they want to indicate that there is a real problem with what a competitor has said, but they wish to leave the dirty work of trashing their competition to others.

Can you possibly be honest enough to admit that?

And as far Hillary's comment being something that she should be sorry for, and which was "unfortunate", can you kindly explain how it is that Hillary made essentially the identical comment in March to Time Magazine without a single word of protest by the Obama campaign or anyone else on the Obama side?

It is nothing but entirely fabricated outrage. And yet, as I said, the Obama campaign initially chose to jump on top of it, and act as if it were a real issue that Hillary and the media must address.

Just once it would be nice to get an honest answer out of you people, just to restore my faith in humanity.


by frankly0 on Sun May 25, 2008 at 01:31:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

Here's a news bit about how Clinton handled bitter-gate, if you are convinced that Obama's handling of this situation was really mean-spirited and "outrageous."

For Clinton, whose once formidable lead in Pennsylvania had dwindled to just 6 percentage points in a Quinnipiac University poll last week, Obama's comments were a gift, and she pounced. The campaign has devoted more than half a dozen press releases to Obama's "bitter" comment, held a weekend conference call with five Pennsylvania mayors, and is responding to Obama's every word on the controversy in an effort to keep the story alive.

So you want to talk honesty?  How about honestly saying that the Obama camp's small and mild statement, followed by dismissals of the story by Obama and Axelrod, is incredible.  If the shoe was on the other foot it WOULD NOT have gone down this way.  Hillary would have made hay with this comment for sure.  So don't get outraged at Obama and PLEASE don't act like I'm the one with my head in the sand.


John McCain isn't evil. He's just wrong about a lot of things. Vote Obama!
by proseandpromise on Sun May 25, 2008 at 03:30:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 11)

They didn't "jump on top" of it.  They were asked a question and a member of the staff gave about as noncommital a statement as possible.  Axelrod later defended Clinton.  Nobody from the Obama campaign made appearances to "gin up outrage," either.  Give it a rest.


by rfahey22 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:14:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 6)

They are never going to give it a rest. The only thing they would have been happy with is Obama himself calling a press conference and announce he is dropping out of the race because her comments were so on the mark.


I read the body count out of the paper; now it's written all over my face.
by JDF on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:27:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

Brillian snark.


McCainuire, The Wrath Of Not Enough Naps.
by catilinus on Sat May 24, 2008 at 04:31:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Clinton is the perpetual victim (2.00 / 2)

according to her supporters.

Even though she invokes an assasination as  a good reason to stay in the race.

Is this uniting or dividing the party.


overthrow the government~participate
by missliberties on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:59:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 4)

It is unfortunate and it has no place in the campaign. But that's all they said. They didn't go after her like she would have gone after him and when it got worse for her Axelrod defended her.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:36:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

That is not all they said. Have you seen the complete press release from Bill Burton, Obama's press secretary?


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:38:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 2)

No. That's all that's been reported in the press. Have a link?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:43:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

There was no press release, just a statement. From what I can gather, here is exactly what was said and by who:

Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton said, "Senator Clinton's statement before the Argus Leader editorial board was unfortunate and has no place in this campaign."


by edg1 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 01:47:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

That's the only thing I saw too.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:34:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (2.00 / 4)

That was a comment after the story had made news.  HRC's remark was unfortunate.  How were they supposed to respond: "Please keep saying that"?  


Obama leads the popular vote too
by kellogg on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:45:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: God, is there no fact or reality (none / 0)

They should have responded the way Axelrod did to Matthews later, any decent human being knows that.

The people here who know how campaign press works, or for that matter have worked in oppo shops, know how this went down. Obama responded immediately after the NY Post story, that tells you something.


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:50:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Please stop lying. (2.00 / 1)

It's one thing to support your candidate. It's another thing altogether to lie.

Obama did not "respond immediately" after the NY Post story. His press spokesman Bill Burton gave a statement when ASKED by reporters about the NY Post story. Burton called it "unfortunate" and stated it "has no place in this campaign."

Stop lying. It does a disservice to your candidate. Any decent human being would know that.


by edg1 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 01:54:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please stop lying. (2.00 / 1)

Burton was not asked, he emailed a statement and a link to the NY Post article according to ABC News:

When Clinton referenced RFK's assassination while discussing previous Democratic nomination fights which stretched into June, she was quickly scolded by the Obama campaign.

"Senator Clinton's statement before the Argus Leader editorial board was unfortunate and has no place in this campaign," wrote Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton in a missive to reporters.

Burton's e-mail included a link to a New York Post story which noted that Obama, who received a Secret Service detail early in the campaign, has been the subject of threats.

I'll assume you have posted in good faith and were just ignorant.


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 02:08:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

That is an OPINION piece, not news. (none / 0)

There is a difference. In opinion you can do just that, state opinion. In news you are supposed to stick to facts.


by edg1 on Sat May 24, 2008 at 02:35:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That is an OPINION piece, not news. (none / 0)

No, it was a reported piece, though it can be hard to tell these days. I take it from your response that you think ABC News is lying about having received an email from Bill Burton with his statement and a link to the NY Post article? And further that they are lying about the Obama campaign having sent this written missive around to reporters?

ABC News is not lying, if anything you have lost touch with the facts in your devotion to Obama.


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 02:59:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Is it possible that the Obama campaign were... (none / 0)

receiving press inquiries and decided to send out to all outlets their response?  The article does not mention whether their was any prior inquiry?  I mean the NY Post article was all over very quickly.  It was ABC that played up to absurdity the Rev. Wright buisness.


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:10:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is it possible that the Obama campaign were... (none / 0)

Anything is possible. If they wanted to shut down the story they would have responded differently. The NY Post article was all over very quickly because the Obama campaign sent their email to so many reporter's blackberries.


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:24:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Is that right? It's not possible that Drudge's... (none / 0)

report prior to the Burton e-mail had alerted people to the statement?


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Sat May 24, 2008 at 09:12:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is that right? It's not possible that Drudge's (none / 0)

It is possible, but you have to be familiar with two things. While Drudge may rule their world, Drudge alone is not an adequate source for a story, and even Drudge looks for a major source before he runs a story.  NY Post + Drudge + Obama press secretary on the record is adequate sourcing for TV.


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 10:24:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This was on TV, before there was any comment... (none / 0)

from Obama's campaign.  In fact, I didn't see a comment from Obama's campaign until an hour after I saw the story on MSNBC.  I think you might want to recheck the timeline.


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Mon May 26, 2008 at 02:36:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Is it possible that the Obama campaign were... (none / 0)

receiving press inquiries and decided to send out to all outlets their response?  The article does not mention whether their was any prior inquiry.  I mean the NY Post article was all over very quickly.  It was ABC that played up to absurdity the Rev. Wright buisness.


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:11:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sorry for the repeat n/t (none / 0)


John McCain wants you to be poor!
by nklein on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:11:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please stop lying. (none / 0)

You said there was more than that. Where is it?


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:35:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please stop lying. (none / 0)

No, the most complete report of Burton's email I've seen is from ABC News. I have not seen a complete reproduction of what Burton wrote.


by souvarine on Sat May 24, 2008 at 05:44:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Please stop lying. (none / 0)

So that's it? That's what I said I heard.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sat May 24, 2008 at 06:27:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]